bogstandard

Looking at the pics in your gallery, it definitely looks like an Elco 80 of some sort.
Elco PT boats evolved at a fair rate during the war, and individual skippers mounted them with weapons arrays of all sorts, as in PT109 fame, where a non standard large gun was mounted (lashed) onto the front deck. Whatever they could beg, borrow or steal, especially in the Pacific areas.
It seems yours is a pseudo type superstructure, with bits and bobs from here and there, but erring towards the later version with drop off torpedoes rather than from a tube.
This shows three boats from different eras, showing how they evolved.

PT Boats, Inc.- Drawing Section - ELCO 80'-PT 103 Series

John

Spyderman_uk

Cheers John!

I had looked at that site but had not come across the drawings section. Very interesting.

I have now decided that my boat will be painted up as if from one of three Squadrons. Ron 29 which served in the Mediterranean under British Coastal Services, fleet numbers Pt 552 - PT 563. Rons 34 + 35 which served for a short period in the English Channel under British jurisdiction, fleet numbers PT 498 - 509 and 510 - 521. This all depends on what I can find out about any of these vessels; ie colours and load-out. Favourite option at the moment is Ron 29 as it served in the same theatre as my initial search and was in duty for a longer period.

Thanks guys, keep the information coming.
Terry

GEEDUBBYA

Howdy Again,

Well i was re-reading the thread and it hit me. There are facts about this model that we can't or shouldnt ignore. The main fact that sticks out in my mind is your statement "It has the serial number of PT201 on the hull so I am presuming it is a Higgins 78".
I believe that just because we cant find the yugoslavic designation for the MGB 181, doesnt mean that we should run off thinking that this model is instead a model of an Elco PT boat. Cleary if it has "PT-201" on the model it was intended to represent "PT-201".
But we must also remember the keyword in that last statement..."represent". Not all modellers are sticklers of detail, I know I myself have been known on many occassions to take certain liberties when making a model which in my opinion, made the model look better to me. I believe most all modellers are guilty of this and "guilty" may be a bad choice of terms here since we are not all re-creating historic pieces in detail.
I guess what i am saying is, I wouldnt go jumping to the conclusion that just because the photo of boat number 211 see in the picture I posted was different from the model you have.
We must remember that the idea of assembly lines wherein all finished goods turn out exactly the same, is or was at the time of wwII, still a developing technology. Even today, finished goods on assembly lines are not all exactly identical, especially in the fields of construction assembly lines such as boats, aircraft and automobiles. Although each of these items are created in an assembly line setting, each one is still built individually by people, people who make mistakes and create the need for "adaptation".
One need only look are items like the Ferrari, Rolls Royce or Harley davidson. Each of these items are created in an assembly line atmosphere, but are still each individually made. This creates some differences in each product from the previous or following product.
So, I guess what i am saying is that if it were me, I wouldnt go off on a tangient looking for an Elco MGB when we have the "PT-201" number from the model and have found plenty of supporting information for its existance.

Now i realize this posting was of very little value and was more of an opinion piece than anything, but, you should step back and evaluate the information you have vs. the information you have been able to find using the info you have. Like i said the PT-201 being on the model is a "fact", the model being in the UK, where PT-201 was transferred to is another "fact". So judging from both of those "facts" I would tend to believe that the model is infact a model of the 201/181 as you first believed and not a model of an Elco PT boat.


have a good day,

Greg

Spyderman_uk

Greg, as always you are most helpful and I agree with the sentiment of what you say.
I went on the same assumptions that you did Greg, that the number is correct and the model is not. It certainly would be more convenient if it was a British vessel, built by a British builder.
However, looking at the images of the different boats and, again assuming that they are correct enough to be representative of the breed, looking at my boat, it is clear that my boat could not be a Higgins 78.
It is going to be far easier for me to change the number to one that fits the boat than change the boat to fit the number! If you see what I mean?

Several thoughts come to mind re the numbering of my boat.
1; It was a kit or plan build of an Elco 80 that had just been numbered with a British number to suit a British builders sensibilities.
2; It was intended to be a model of PT201 but plans were not available of the exact type and so was compromised.
3; It was built from plans that were less than precise about the type and model and were more generic.
4; Parts from some or all of the above.

I'm tending to favour either number 1 or 3 at the moment.
At the end of the day it looks more like an Elco 80' than any other type, so that is what I am going to restore it as.

After finding out so much about PT201 I may be inclined to build another boat at a later date to commemorate it. We shall see!
I do have a KD Perkasa and 3 tugs to get around to as well.

Terry

bogstandard

Terry,
If you are going to refurbish it, yank out that old taycol motor and bin it.
It will cause hours of heartache trying to get it to run in fwd and reverse (has to have a mechanical switching mechanism), and even then you will find your radio will have a permanent case of the twitches.
They have very little intrinsic value, except for maybe curiosity.
I used mine to power my Martek drill sharpener rather than an electric drill. Powered it with my car battery charger.

John

Spyderman_uk

Thanks guys!
I visited Model Boat Mayhem, cheers Bunkerbarge, and had an immediate reply, recognising my boat as an Aerokits Patrol Torpedo Boat. It even had a price on the add of £7/8s/3d (148/3).
So now I know how it started I still need to decide how it ends up.

linebacker55

Back in 1981 my family decided to try living on the river, and our search for a suitable craft took us to Conyer , which is in Kent England, upon the River Swale...a tributary of The River Medway, not far from The Isle of Sheppey.

The craft in Question was a Motor Torpedo Boat, and as it was a long time ago, I'm not sure what her pennant number was but 210 comes to mind...
Anyway, this boat was 72 feet in length, was built from money raised by War Bonds, (in this case by the good people of East Anglia) and she had been equipped with three Rolls-Royce Merlin 10 engines, of a similar type found in Tanks, Spitfres, etc., although many MTB's had Packard Merlins (built under License in The States), or often what ever could be stuffed into them.

Tagged as 'expendable', these boats and the heroic crews which served in them sadly often came to grief rather abruptly, and to see this fine, once super-fast attack boat in such a sorry state brought a lump to my throat.

Anyway... Construction was "Double-Diagonal", which was two diagonally opposed thin layers of Marine Plywood, with a canvas and pitch (tar soaked) skin between the layers of ply. Air-Sea Rescue Launches were made the same way, as were MGB's, but the latter were larger. Colour would have been Battleship Grey as a rule. Armed usually with twin Oerlikons in a motorised aircraft turret above and behind the windshield/conning position.

I assumed this particular Boat was made in England, but I'm not certain.
Sadly the boat had daylight visible down by the water line when we looked into the forward cable locker, also someone had cut wood windows into her hull, but as was usual with MTB's there wasn't any superstructure to speak of, but she was at least recognisable. Below decks was a plaque made of brass with her number, and her builder's plaque from somewhere on our east coast up near Great Yarmouth I think, but I'm not sure now. We knew she would probably sink if moved, so we bought a 64 foot twin-screw Naval Pinnace instead, built in 1945 at Chatham Royal Naval Dockyard.

soldier151

Hi, Just picked up your thread, In Model Boats Aug 2004 there was a Free Plan and Feature for a Higgins 78 MTB, plus in Marini Modellinging International Mar 2005 John Lambert did an excellent Plan Feature on MTBs & MGBs.
I have a database of about 20 years back issues of these magazines which I am constantly updating (massive task) so all articles are listed alphabetically, about 5000) so if I find anything more, will contact
Soldier151

Spyderman_uk

After starting this quest I have taken a big interest in MTB, MGB and Mls, also the German E boats. Am busy reading Flag 4 by Dudley Pope at the moment, a very interesting and informative account of small vessels in the Mediterranean. I love how, wherever possible, he quotes the report from the opposing vessels as well as the allied reports. How at least one Captain reported sinking a boat that wasn't even in that region!

I am really surprised how little credit is/was given to the crews who served on these vessels during the war. Not only were most of them volunteer reserves, but nearly all fought at such short range and showed extremely high levels of bravery. Where are all the Movies and documentaries about these guys?

So Soldier151, as far as I am concerned you can post as much information as possible about these creatures of stealth and speed!

Spyderman_uk

I took the Taycol motor out and tried it on the bench.
I can see how it would cause interference issues, loads of sparks flying from the armature.
I wonder if the original builder ever got it running as I could not get it to rotate in the correct direction. It would be going in reverse all the time no matter which way you connected the power to it. Very strange!
Looks like a Torpedo 850 will be fitted as soon as funds allow.