Ammo by Mig won't dry in this humid weather...

[Jens Andrée]

I've had nothing but trouble with my Ammo by Mig paints that I bought for my Takom King Tiger, and after weeks and weeks of practise I've finally managed to learn how to use them!

Sadly this was a short lived victory because now the damn thing refuse to dry... sigh. (it did dry properly previously)

I know it's the end of August and it's getting rather humid - especially when you live in an old house made of raw clay bricks. (old unburned clay bricks)
I'm using the correct thinner when airbrushing and I'm adding very thin layers - and allow at least 24 hours of drying time between sprays, but it won't fully dry even after 5 days and the model is slightly sticky and the paint scratches if you touch it with something hard... Sanding won't be possible at all!

Is this just something you have to live with or is there something you can do to fix it (I don't have a hair dryer for obvious reasons... ) or is it a no-go area when it's humid?

I love the colours that you get with Ammo paints but damn they're problematic compared to my Tamiya paints - and when mixed with iso it fully dries in a couple of minutes!

Edit: Ammo by Mig is 100% acrylic paint - no solvents or alcohol. For those who haven't used that brand.

Many thanks in advance!

Jens

 

[Jens Andrée]

No tips or tricks on how to work with pure acrylics from AMMO when humid?
Should I invest in a hair dryer - if that even solves the problem? (they're not expensive so it's no big deal, but I've got zero use for a hair dryer if it doesn't work... )

 

[Tony]

Not used the paint range myself but something does mot sound right for such a modern paint not drying.

Have you used a primer because that is something they say should be used.

The only other thought would be is the paint correctly mixed as i am not a fan of dropper bottles without a shaker ball as i find then difficult to mix if they have been standing for any length of time. Always been a big fan of paint you can get too with a cocktail stick to give it a right good stir.

 

[col68]

Having the same problems Jens the paint is drying on the needle to quickly and when I did manage to get everything to spray its taking 12-18 hours for paint to dry. I have tried the hairdryer but that's not drying it properly either.
I think I'll stick to Tamiya for spraying from now on

 

[Jens Andrée]

Not used the paint range myself but something does mot sound right for such a modern paint not drying.

Have you used a primer because that is something they say should be used.

The only other thought would be is the paint correctly mixed as i am not a fan of dropper bottles without a shaker ball as i find then difficult to mix if they have been standing for any length of time. Always been a big fan of paint you can get too with a cocktail stick to give it a right good stir.

Good and valid points Tony but sadly I'm ticking all those boxes.

Initially nothing I did with the AMMO paints worked and it made me frustrated and mad - but obviously some people are saying they're the "best paints on the market" so it had to be user error...
Anyhow, I soldiered on and eventually I learned how to use the AMMO paint. The process is terrible and it takes forever, but it worked.
This was in July whereas now it's the end of August and I'd finally worked up the courage to start using the AMMO paints on the two most expensive models I'm building and that's when this happened...

The model in question is properly primed, but with a solvent based primer because the AMMO primer is crap. I'm sorry for my language but it is compared to the other ones I've got.
The only thinner that works with AMMO is their own thinner, so I bought some. That's what made it work in July.
The dropper bottles have ball bearings in them - and I also give them a good stir with a stick prior, so it can't be that.

I've sprayed the model according to the instructions of Mig himself with super fine layers initially to build up the paint, but when I put the last layer on - where you can put a bit more than just a cloud of mist, this happened. It's still a very thin layer but...

I thought I'd finally cracked how to use these paints but obviously no. Perhaps you have to live in Spain or similar hot country to make it work? I don't know...

Thanks for your pointers though!

 

[Jens Andrée]

Having the same problems Jens the paint is drying on the needle to quickly and when I did manage to get everything to spray its taking 12-18 hours for paint to dry. I have tried the hairdryer but that's not drying it properly either.
I think I'll stick to Tamiya for spraying from now on

My experience too but I've found a method where it doesn't clog up the needle.
18 hours drying time I can live with just to get it done, but the model I've got right in front of me now has been drying for 5 days and it's still sticky!?!
Also the paint hasn't "cured" yet and it's easy to scrape off, which means it scratched easily... Not what you want exactly.

If I can only use AMMO paint in the spring and early summer it's pretty useless. I wish I'd stuck to my Tamiya paints but I was fooled by the fantastic photos of the Takom King Tiger painted with AMMO by Mig paints and now I'm stuck feeling depressed and frustrated by these paints and a beautiful model that's yet again stuck on the bench in a corner dangerously close to the bin...

I won't buy a hair dryer then, thanks for the heads up Colin!

 

[Tony]

Good and valid points Tony but sadly I'm ticking all those boxes.

Initially nothing I did with the AMMO paints worked and it made me frustrated and mad - but obviously some people are saying they're the "best paints on the market" so it had to be user error...
Anyhow, I soldiered on and eventually I learned how to use the AMMO paint. The process is terrible and it takes forever, but it worked.
This was in July whereas now it's the end of August and I'd finally worked up the courage to start using the AMMO paints on the two most expensive models I'm building and that's when this happened...

The model in question is properly primed, but with a solvent based primer because the AMMO primer is crap. I'm sorry for my language but it is compared to the other ones I've got.
The only thinner that works with AMMO is their own thinner, so I bought some. That's what made it work in July.
The dropper bottles have ball bearings in them - and I also give them a good stir with a stick prior, so it can't be that.

I've sprayed the model according to the instructions of Mig himself with super fine layers initially to build up the paint, but when I put the last layer on - where you can put a bit more than just a cloud of mist, this happened. It's still a very thin layer but...

I thought I'd finally cracked how to use these paints but obviously no. Perhaps you have to live in Spain or similar hot country to make it work? I don't know...

Thanks for your pointers though!

Jens

Really sorry to hear the problems these paints are causing you. They sound really complicated to use.

I have not done much model making for some years now and justing getting back into it was surprised by all of these new paint brands. I assumed they would all be high tech and good quality.

I hope that some of the other builders that are familiar with this paint might be able to help you.

Just one after thought but did mig have a customer helpdesk you could contact?

 

[Jens Andrée]

Just one after thought but did mig have a customer helpdesk you could contact?

Well, I assume they have but I'd rather know I'm not doing anything stupid before I jump down that rabbit hole...
I have a feeling it could be taken as criticism if I claim their paints doesn't work when a bit humid and that won't lead anywhere good. When checking comments on their youtube account, (on their instructional videos) negative comments, or questions, are never answered.

I also find it better to ask users of a product rather than the manufacturer when having issues because a manufacturer will always be biased whereas users are honest.

I've only spent perhaps £30 on these paints so it's not a huge loss throwing them in the bin, but the two models I'm painting with this paint I've spent a lot more - and even more time...
That's why I really want to see if there's anything that can be done when humid to solve this problem, but it certainly doesn't look so.

I'll have to buy a sack of salt and pour all around the spray booth to suck up all the moisture.

 

[BarryW]

This is the problem with all water based acrylics such as MIG, Vallejo and AK Interactive. I had the problem on my last build using Vallejo, I placed the model in my airing cupboard overnight and it came out perfectly dry the next morning. Not all homes have an airing cupboard these days of course.

That really will be my very last build using water based acrylics, after 5 years of using them, now I have discovered MRP paints.... another story.

 

[Jens Andrée]

Thank you Barry for your comment on what I suspected, that these so called "safe" paints are cumbersome to use unless the environment (and technique) is perfect.
Airing cupboards is pretty much unheard of in my neck of the woods since we've been wet curing our foods in the past to conserve them.
I guess I could build a large vacuum contraption to aid drying the paint, but steps like that are a bit too extreme to be honest, and having a compressor running to maintain the vacuum and to get rid of the moisture is a no go for me.

MRP paints sounds wonderful to use because lacquer paints dry almost instantly, but sadly all lacquer paints are banned here since almost 10 years ago and for a while all oil based paints were banned at the same time. The oil based paints have been partly allowed again for artistic, and historical, reasons, but no lacquer. This is simple to overcome though by placing an overseas order

I think I've got enough information on this subject to abandon all water based acrylics and just stick to my Tamiya paints thinned with iso. They work superbly well.
Finding the correct colours is another thing, and that's why I wanted to try the AMMO range - but the colours are of little meaning if the paint doesn't work!

I'm going to try to finish the two models I've started to paint with AMMO but after that I will happily chuck them in the bin!

Cheers

 

[BarryW]

Thank you Barry for your comment on what I suspected, that these so called "safe" paints are cumbersome to use unless the environment (and technique) is perfect.
Airing cupboards is pretty much unheard of in my neck of the woods since we've been wet curing our foods in the past to conserve them.
I guess I could build a large vacuum contraption to aid drying the paint, but steps like that are a bit too extreme to be honest, and having a compressor running to maintain the vacuum and to get rid of the moisture is a no go for me.

MRP paints sounds wonderful to use because lacquer paints dry almost instantly, but sadly all lacquer paints are banned here since almost 10 years ago and for a while all oil based paints were banned at the same time. The oil based paints have been partly allowed again for artistic, and historical, reasons, but no lacquer. This is simple to overcome though by placing an overseas order

I think I've got enough information on this subject to abandon all water based acrylics and just stick to my Tamiya paints thinned with iso. They work superbly well.
Finding the correct colours is another thing, and that's why I wanted to try the AMMO range - but the colours are of little meaning if the paint doesn't work!

I'm going to try to finish the two models I've started to paint with AMMO but after that I will happily chuck them in the bin!

Cheers

Tamiya are laquer based Jens...an oversea order perhaps!!! MRP are actually similar to them (and Gunze) except they have a better colour range and are 'airbrush ready' in 30ml bottles.
If you want to make a overseas order for MRP then Ushi in Germany might be a good option for you.
https://www.uschivdr.com/shopping-c...ts-pigments-primer/mr-paint-superfine-inks-1/

 

[Jens Andrée]

Tamiya are laquer based Jens...an oversea order perhaps!!! MRP are actually similar to them (and Gunze) except they have a better colour range and are 'airbrush ready' in 30ml bottles.
If you want to make a overseas order for MRP then Ushi in Germany might be a good option for you.
https://www.uschivdr.com/shopping-c...ts-pigments-primer/mr-paint-superfine-inks-1/

Hmmm... I thought Tamiya was acrylic + "good" solvent based paints and not lacquer?
Perhaps I'm lost in translation here because lacquer paints here (in Sweden) are all alkyd based, i.e. "bad" solvents compared to isopropanol and cellulose thinner.

Tamiya paints are perfectly legal here and so should also MRP be in that case. I'm going to have a look at their range of colours because they should be fully compatible with Tamiya paints. (not mixing perhaps, but paint on paint)

Thank you for the link and clarification Barry!

Edit: It turns out that Mr.Paint / MRP is available in Sweden. I'm now checking the range.

 

[BarryW]

Acrylics can come with a solvent or water based medium.

That's good news Jens..... the thing with MRP is how they produce very specific paints and label them that way. The range is really extensive and they are releasing 50 new colours next month including WW2 Italian colour and later WW2 IJN and IJA aircraft colours..... A total contrast to Tamiya with all that mixing to get the right shades!!

 

[Jens Andrée]

I just counted 303 different Mr.Paint products (including primers and such) but it's still a more than impressive range of colours, and they're adding another 50?!
I don't mind mixing my own paints in order to achieve the right colour, but I'd rather buy the right ones from start to be honest... Am I getting lazy with age or is it experience?

I shall no more fall for advertising like I did with Takom/AMMO and thinking the extra work would outweigh the results and instead stick to what works best.
Famous last words, I know, but these water based acrylics are not for me.

 

[BarryW]

Its not lazy Jens - its keeping the focus on the build, making progress and not diverting attention to d.i.y......

Yes, it is a great range with more to come. They just keep on bringing out new colours at an impressive rate and the results are outstanding. If you have followed my build, reviewing these, you will see why I will not now spray anything else.

Incidentally - I don't know if you noticed but they are bringing out a range of water based colours 'Aqua' they are called. No doubt they will have done an impressive job with them but once bitten by the solvent based acrylics there is no going back.....