Frustration over dodgy, very expensive, kit...

[Jens Andrée]

As some of you know I forked out the money and ordered the Haunebu II kit from Squadron a bit earlier.
It was way more expensive than I could afford but I really wanted one (which I'm sure I don't have to explain here ) so I went for it anyway.

I can't remember the exact price right now, partly because I'm in denial, but it was more than £90 so a fair bit of quality was expected.

When I started the assembly - which is super-easy with just a couple of really big parts - it became clear very early that the two halves that make up the bottom side of the disc was not like they should. Not one of them at least.

When I tried to join them I could only line up one of the edges, not both. With the centre base (for the control room) in place it was impossible to make the two halves to meet up level.
We're talking 10-12 mm gap here - and the plastic pieces are extremely thick so it's not just a case of a bit of bending and you're done...

I know we have to expect some bending when we're dealing with thermoplastics but in my mind there's a limit to what one can accept - especially when buying a premium kit!

Anyhow, I soldiered on, attempted to use a lot of force, even heating, but when I managed to get the edges to line up there was now a "bulge" a bit further in, because the plastic part wasn't level. sigh...

I first tried cement and clamping but that snapped as soon as I let go of the clamps. CA glue to the rescue, or so I thought, but the same effect... I clamped up the piece the third time and clued on as much support on the backside as I could fit, and I used a high strength CA glue that I built up very thickly on the backside with the help of spray activator - and this time it didn't snap when I let go of the clamps, but an awful lot of putty was going to be needed to make them appear even again, and the mating side of one of the halves would require some serious plastic removal - which would make it weaker.

One of the halves was also noticeable less wide than the other and required a lot of putty to build up the edge, to form a perfect circle. When sanding the perimeter of the disc the reinforced glue joint snapped again... :mad:
By now I was rather upset so I documented the scenario and sent a polite email to Squadron helpdesk.

I described the situation that there must've been something wrong in the moulding/de-moulding process and that I couldn't continue the build. I was super polite and asked if I could PURCHASE the faulty parts (hoping they'd give me replacement parts for free) so I could finish the build?!

Their answer was in line with "this is a normal issue, nothing we can do"...

I got pretty angry with that answer so I didn't reply. I've tried to learn that if you've got nothing nice to say then don't say anything at all. Sadly this doesn't work as well as being honest, but this is a hobby and not my professional work so I try to be humble.

Anyhow, last night I was looking at the damn box again where it's sitting, almost in the bin, thinking enough is enough so I sent my reply to their answer, not accepting that this is a "normal issue". A few weeks have now passed and I've calmed down and got some distance to the situation.

I supplied yet another photo that should highlight the issue better, but I sadly didn't take the pictures I should've during construction because I was focusing on making it work - not having a photo session, but the two pictures plus my detailed description should be more than adequate for them to act. That's my opinion.

This has taken all of my creativity and made modelling just a big pile of frustration - and that's not what I wanted.

The store that sold the kit to me were super friendly and very supportive but I haven't contacted them yet. I went straight to Squadron instead since they're the maker of the kit. Regardless they are the ones who need this feedback, not someone just selling it.

If I don't get the help I should get from Squadron I will contact the store I bought it from to see if they can help me? I'd rather they didn't have to do what Squadron should do, but it's a very expensive kit that should fit out of the box.

Here are the pictures I sent. The plastic parts are very thick and not easily bendable - which makes them store a lot of spring force when bent anyway. Not what you want in a model...

I don't know the rules here about outing a company before things are settled, but since it's no secret that it's Squadrons own kit there was little point in trying to hide their name.

They still have the chance to change their opinion - which I will happily receive and publicly write about, but for now I'm not impressed and I regret spending all that money on a kit bent out of shape...

I hope I'm not unrealistic trying to get new parts when mine are dodgy, but this is not a £10 70's kit where you have to accept lesser quality - this is a kit, by modellers - for modellers, and a premium one too...

I got back into modelling again as a form of therapy after some serious life altering events that I'm really struggling with, and that has had a fantastic effect on me. That's why I didn't need this.

Let's hope I get a positive answer this time! Just wanted to share...

 

[Jack10]

Hope they get back to you and sort it jens! Not good at all when you've paid a lot of money! I also got back into this as a form of stress relief and I'm battling a gambling addiction so getting into modelling was a way to occupy my mind on something other than gambling. So it's a hobby you want to be able to get away from all other the stresses in life and things like a dodgy kit don't help that!

 

[Mr Bowcat]

I'd name and shame on Facebook, it's amazing how companies will u-turn when the complaint is open for the world to see.

 

[Jens Andrée]

I have no problem whatsoever to publicly write about this in detail which will cost them a lot more than doing the right thing the first time, but I'd rather just wish these companies would try to maintain high quality instead of admitting when something's wrong - which can happen to everyone!

The Haunebu II should be such a limited run anyway - and an important one since it's the only ever kit produced/made by Squadron - that I was rather shocked that they gave such a bs answer...

Let's see how they respond to my reply and I'll act accordingly afterwards. Just weird how a company that solely relies on people like us buying their products try to ignore customers with faulty items rather than just replacing them right away - which is a guarantee for an excellent review etc, whereas this won't and 10x more people will read negative reviews rather than positive ones.

Scale model kits, regardless of price and manufacturer, should at least fit together without having to do major modifications, and when they're too bent out of shape they should be replaced without having to ask for it more than once.

Thanks for your support guys!

 

[Bigfoot57]

Jens
I have just watched their promo video for that saucer must say I want one now as well ebay here I come they claim it is very very nice tooling and detail etc.
So how the hell can they balls up the two halves is utterly unbelievable and as you say its their first in house kit so you would think they would be more communicative with your request and at least give you the option to purchase another piece that actually lines up so as to foster a good pr with their buyers companies like them tend not to last too long when they for want of a better word p off their clients and as other people have said if you don't get a reply from them facebook it then see what they do

Regards

Colin

 

[Gern]

Sorry to hear of your problems with this kit Jens. Also a bit surprised after watching this build review:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...50BBEF2683BBDAD7A0CE50BBEF2683BBD&FORM=VRDGAR

I had got this on my 'to buy' list but I think I'll wait and see what they say to you. As you say, it's quite expensive and if there's some doubt about the quality, there's plenty of other kits out there for me to spend my money on!

 

[Jens Andrée]

Jens
I have just watched their promo video for that saucer must say I want one now as well ebay here I come they claim it is very very nice tooling and detail etc.
So how the hell can they balls up the two halves is utterly unbelievable and as you say its their first in house kit so you would think they would be more communicative with your request and at least give you the option to purchase another piece that actually lines up so as to foster a good pr with their buyers companies like them tend not to last too long when they for want of a better word p off their clients and as other people have said if you don't get a reply from them facebook it then see what they do

Regards

Colin

Cheers Colin!

For a brief moment I was worried that I expected too much from this kit (and all other kits) and would appear silly/bitchy for complaining - but I will stick to my belief that a kit, regardless of who's made it, should fit during assembly!
I'm an engineer and I know my way around materials and creating from scratch so it's not a case of me not knowing what to do - but you shouldn't have to, and especially when you have to use a lot of force to glue two pieces together, which game apart anyway due to spring tension...

I hope for everyone's sake that they have a change of heart and do what they should've done the first time I asked because I hoped the people involved in this hobby were mostly descent people who loved the hobby and not just did it to make money - although I'm more than ok with the business side of it too, as long as the goods and support is spot on.
That's why I didn't complain to the seller first because they really went beyond in order to ship the box to me and I didn't want to bother them when they'd done everything right. I will contact them eventually to let them know what happened so that they can bring up the criticism which Squadron must (?) listen to...

Anyhow, they didn't respond today but there's been a fair bit of chaos in some parts of Texas (where they are based) so I will give it until Tuesday until I start being very honest!

Luckily I started building a Tamiya Nashorn 1/35 earlier in the week just to focus on something positive and that's a 10 out of 10 kit with regards to sprue quality!!!
Best kit I've assembled to date! More than a few tricky pieces that has to line up perfectly, but they all did and zero putty was required. That's the gold standard if you ask me!

 

[Jens Andrée]

Sorry to hear of your problems with this kit Jens. Also a bit surprised after watching this build review:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...50BBEF2683BBDAD7A0CE50BBEF2683BBD&FORM=VRDGAR

I had got this on my 'to buy' list but I think I'll wait and see what they say to you. As you say, it's quite expensive and if there's some doubt about the quality, there's plenty of other kits out there for me to spend my money on!

All the reviews, and builds, I've seen have been great and only a little putty was required on the upper hull to close the tiny gaps between the panels, which is fair.
That's why I didn't hesitate to claim that I had parts that were dodgy from moulding/de-moulding because of the issues I had.

It's still a fantastic kit if you're into the wonders of wunderwaffe, but a broken kit makes no great model - and certainly no happy modellers...

I hope they do right and all is honky dory afterwards but so far it's not looking too inspiring.

 

[PaulTRose]

when these two parts are joined whats the diameter of the disc?

 

[Jens Andrée]

when these two parts are joined whats the diameter of the disc?

14" according to the box.

 

[PaulTRose]

then to me that would to be expected to a certain degree

plastic injection moulding is not like working in metal.....there will always be some element of shrink and warpage during the cooling time after injection....the bigger the part the more chance of shrink, ....probably these two parts (and the rest of the kit) are made in one tooling all on the same shot but that dosnt mean all of it will be perfect.......other things can affect it like not warming up the tooling or getting dwell times wrong, or shot time wrong, material might have high moisture content and an endless list of other things, and styrene is a lot more finicky than PE or PP or PU cos its so much more brittle

id still be interested to know what the manufacturer says

 

[Jens Andrée]

then to me that would to be expected to a certain degree

plastic injection moulding is not like working in metal.....there will always be some element of shrink and warpage during the cooling time after injection....the bigger the part the more chance of shrink, ....probably these two parts (and the rest of the kit) are made in one tooling all on the same shot but that dosnt mean all of it will be perfect.......other things can affect it like not warming up the tooling or getting dwell times wrong, or shot time wrong, material might have high moisture content and an endless list of other things, and styrene is a lot more finicky than PE or PP or PU cos its so much more brittle

id still be interested to know what the manufacturer says

I certainly agree that some minor deviation from "perfect" can be expected - but my opinion is still that the pieces should fit together, even if they are 14 inches wide.
The shrinkage I had to fix isn't something I'm complaining about, I'm just pointing out that it could be an indication that there's something wrong elsewhere - like my part(s).
The two bottom hull pieces not fitting at all and require a lot of force, strengthening and reshaping is what I'm complaining about - especially since it's snapped so many times after gluing...

We'll see how they respond after my second email. Perhaps they misunderstood my first email, although I don't think so...

I think we should query issues we find with our kits in order to maintain quality rather than just accept them and stay silent. A £90 kit isn't something you just chuck in the bin due to bad luck. Not in my world anyway.

 

[Jens Andrée]

Well, Squadron haven't even bothered to answer my reply to their response so I'm no longer going to play nice.

 

[Jens Andrée]

Some sort of "public announcement" from my part.

https://www.scalemates.com/profiles/mate.php?id=32827&p=projects&project=34062

I'm not a big fan on Facebook, and my user is a hidden one anyway, so there's little point posting something there because it'll only be visible to my friends.
I hope scalemates can work better. At least others have a chance of reading my issues before ordering one themselves.

It's a fantastic kit if the parts are correct, but their customer support is really terrible.
That's my honest opinion anyway and I've tried to be more than polite to them.

Some of you might not agree, and that's fine, but "that's normal, nothing we can do" isn't how you run a business.

End of rant. (unless they miraculous respond in the next couple of hours sorting this out - which I doubt...)

 

[Jens Andrée]

So, some activity...
Squadron Signal (their book publisher) have reacted somewhat and quite a few people have voiced their opinions about the ordeal, supporting me.
I'm not breaking out the popcorn just yet, but we'll see what happens later this evening?

 

[Jens Andrée]

It's obvious Squadron isn't going to bother contacting me over this.

I've now contacted eModels in UK whom I bought it from to let them know what happened, and if they have any channels to Squadron?
I didn't want to have to involve eModels since they were so super nice and helpful to me when ordering the kit, but they're my only solution right now and they need to know anyway that Squadron isn't bothered about their customers.

I really hate doing this and I don't want to sound "bitchy", but right is right and a dodgy kit it was.

If it wasn't so damn expensive I'd just cobble it together and put a healthy quantity of black powder inside it and give it a vikings funeral!

 

[Jens Andrée]

The UK store I bought the kit from has also contacted Squadron but guess what... nothing. No reply to me.
I don't understand what's wrong here?
Was I too polite when I asked for help the first time or are they just a bunch of &%#%# ?

A lot of people on scalemates have contacted me to say that they will never buy from Squadron again after hearing this so it's going to be a bigger loss for Squadron than if they'd just sent me the parts - or even letting me buy the parts (which I initially offered to do).

I didn't complain for the money, I complained because the quality was way under par. Sadly they don't seem to care about their customers.

Unless something happens I won't post anything more in this thread either because nobody's reading it anyway. Perhaps most modellers don't care about quality?

 

[Jack10]

They sound like a bunch of *******s to be honest mate. I've been following your thread mate don't worry I'm on your side I'd be fuming if I'd paid that much for a dodgy kit. Most companies know the consequences of a bad review so are quick to reply and try sort the problem so I don't know why it's different for. Squadron

 

[Jens Andrée]

They sound like a bunch of *******s to be honest mate. I've been following your thread mate don't worry I'm on your side I'd be fuming if I'd paid that much for a dodgy kit. Most companies know the consequences of a bad review so are quick to reply and try sort the problem so I don't know why it's different for. Squadron

Cheers mate!
In this case they didn't seem to care at all. The people who are running their publishing side reacted very quickly though and talked to Squadron modelling side, but that led to absolutely nothing.
It's just like they couldn't be bothered. They quickly responded to my first email but after that nothing. Not even when they were reminded from at least two other sources.

I don't know if the store I bought the kit from is able to talk to them but it's not really their job to do that. Product failures are the responsibility of the manufacturer, not the 3:rd part that is selling it.
If the store offers to replace it I will be happy, but it wouldn't be right.

I've not done any modelling since this happened because it took all my inspiration and happiness for the hobby away. Not precisely great when you're doing this to battle severe depression...

I'll get over it, no worries, but it made me rather upset because I thought people who work with this hobby, albeit earning money on it too, were grown people trying to be nice to each other!? Sadly there are some cowboys too who're just in for the money... Bummer because what made me buy the kit in the end, even when I couldn't afford it, was to show my appreciation to Squadron for daring to make their own, a bit wacky, expensive kit. This I regret.

Luckily I've got Tamiya, Takom, Meng, Trumpeter, Dragon Hobbyboss, MasterBox etc etc to fall back on knowing that if I receive a dodgy kit they will help you to sort it out!

 

[Jack10]

Cheers mate!
In this case they didn't seem to care at all. The people who are running their publishing side reacted very quickly though and talked to Squadron modelling side, but that led to absolutely nothing.
It's just like they couldn't be bothered. They quickly responded to my first email but after that nothing. Not even when they were reminded from at least two other sources.

I don't know if the store I bought the kit from is able to talk to them but it's not really their job to do that. Product failures are the responsibility of the manufacturer, not the 3:rd part that is selling it.
If the store offers to replace it I will be happy, but it wouldn't be right.

I've not done any modelling since this happened because it took all my inspiration and happiness for the hobby away. Not precisely great when you're doing this to battle severe depression...

I'll get over it, no worries, but it made me rather upset because I thought people who work with this hobby, albeit earning money on it too, were grown people trying to be nice to each other!? Sadly there are some cowboys too who're just in for the money... Bummer because what made me buy the kit in the end, even when I couldn't afford it, was to show my appreciation to Squadron for daring to make their own, a bit wacky, expensive kit. This I regret.

Luckily I've got Tamiya, Takom, Meng, Trumpeter, Dragon Hobbyboss, MasterBox etc etc to fall back on knowing that if I receive a dodgy kit they will help you to sort it out!

That's shit bud I'm currently signed off work with depression too due to my gambling so I know what your going through, I'm doing lots of figures at the moment to take mind off the depression and it's working. You got any other kits to crack on with while this try's to get resolved?