Discussion in 'General Military Vehicle Chat' started by Robert1968, Jun 1, 2015.
This is interesting about the Tiger 131.
This is Part 1 there are 5 parts to this.
The only thing I would say about the Tiger is that it was the most feared Axis tank by all the allies, and that it was under powered, and was prone to mechanical failures, never enough of them in the field...other than that I would sooner have one of them, than any other tank, unlesss it was the Tiger 11
I've always found allied vehicles mundane for modeling.the tiger however is something else,but saying that I have built,painted T34's,and kv's. Very interesting subjects
Ps I also find 19th century warfare interesting.
2 words why the tiger is one of my favs...Michael Wittman. While not the highest scoring ace, he certainly was the most popular at the time.
My take on the tiger and German armour in general , the Germans showed the world how to effectively use the tank and had the best tanks , better looking tanks , faster tanks , the whole caboose, but did they , at the start of the war believe it or not the best tank although admittedly one of the slowest was the Matilda it had thicker armour and could take out any German tank at close range with its 2pdr gun and it gave the Germans a bloody nose in Africa at first and it was Rommel who first used the 88mm AA gun against tanks as he got fed up of seeing his anti tank shells bounce of the Tilly ha this changed everything in tank warfare the Germans realised that a tank needed beefing up in power and in protection and we didn't realise or more acuratly we didn't have the economic clout to do it and we had a bunch of old duffers still thinking about trench warfare and using tanks in a support role instead of part of a main attack vehicle
The Germans added extra armour and refitted older tanks with bigger guns to keep ahead and either they realised the chassis of the panzer IV was so adaptable or it was built with this in mind they could easily refit their tanks , the tiger I came out around 43 but by now allied bombing was starting to take its toll on the Germans ability to produce large quantities and many tanks were rushed to be operational hence all the mechanical problems all their later tanks stuffed from this
The Germans may have had better tanks on paper but reliability and quantity wise they weren't
I personally look at tigers and look at the churchills and say the churchills were better looking
I think you need glasses Alan!
Mind you, most Churchill crews never saw the Tiger that killed them!
Hmm it's funny then that German tank production was higher in 1944 than at any time during the war!
It wasn't bombing of industrial manufacturing that crippled the German war effort, but the decision in early '44 to target oil production.
This lead to a severe lack of fuel for training & operations which hit the Luftwaffe & armoured divisions the hardest.
It wasn't the quantity I was referring to it was the quality , they were rushed out the door and then broke down
Most king Tigers were abandoned not due to being knocked out but because they broke down
No, that was because of a lack of fuel!
The teething troubles that tanks like the Panther experienced were quickly put right.
Certain variants ( Jagdtiger springs to mind) were unreliable because they were unfit for purpose, but in the main German tanks performed as well as any other countries did.
Kurt knispel would surely disagree about the quality of the king.
Well if that's the case how can you explain why the first batch of king tigers delivered had to be destroyed to prevent capture due to them breaking down , they had loads of problems , gaskets , seals, drive train , all failed on them , sure this was sorted over time but my point stands as they were rushed out without proper testing , the drive train was for another tank not the KT if that's not down to lack of parts or rushing I don't know what is
And all British tanks looked better than there German tanks this is my opinion
Alan, that's just silly! All new weapons suffer from teething troubles, especially if they're desperately needed. Look at the introduction of the SA -80, it still happens today!
The Tiger II initially experienced numerous automotive problems which required a continuous series of minor modifications to correct.
These problems can be traced to two main causes: leaking seals and gaskets and an over taxed drive train originally designed for a 40 metric ton vehicle. The problem of keeping a Tiger II in running condition was compounded by a shortage of skilled drivers many of whom may have never experienced driving any vehicle prior to entering the service. In addition they were provided only limited driver's training, and then usually on a different type of panzer, and received their own Tiger II usually within a few days before being shipped to the front. But, with mature drivers, taking required maintenance halts, and modification of key automotive components, the Tiger II could be maintained in a satisfactory operational condition.
Status reports from the Western Front, dated March 1945, showed that the percentage of Tigers operational at the Front was about equal to the PzKpfw IV and as good as or better than the Panther.
And there's documentary proof for this!
Looks aside, I'd prefer sitting in the tank that can take out a Sherman, Cromwell or T -34 at 3500 metres!
Patrick I would not call something that could cripple a tank a teething problem , these things couldn't be fixed , by the time they had sufficiently solved the problems it was game over , sort of shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted , I can't understand why you can't acknowledge the fact and it is a fact that it took them months to get them to full stream the and by this time the war was lost well and truly and they were fighting time , if you equate the actual effect these tanks had on the war it probably extended it by a month or two at the outside , the beginning problems to months to solve so I doubt you could use teething and an argument
What??!! You could consider that the war was over after the fall of Stalingrad in January '43! So everything done past that point was merely delaying the inevitable.
Tiger IIs were fully combat operational after the battle of Normandy & achieved kills to losses ratios of 8 to 1 on average in the East. Without them it's quite possible that the Russian advance would have been much quicker.
That could have led to Austria, Denmark & all of Germany being behind the Iron Curtain. Not a pleasant thought!
Perhaps you should bone up on the campaigns of the Eastern Front, which is where 80% of the German war effort was used?
Lets just agree to disagree Patrick we won't agree on it
But I know I'm right
Bovington's Tiger actually uses the engine of their Porsche turreted King Tiger, as the original was sectioned and is on display near the T34/85 in the museum, check the rear end of the king tiger and it has no engine just a big empty space, also says this in the restoration video from the museum about 131.
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