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- Jakko
M70A2 Krueger MBT, Gulf War, 1991 (MBT 70 “What If?”)
- Thread starter Jakko
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Mark1
SMF Supporter
Nice work again 
Jim R
SMF Supporter
Hi Jakko
An excellent model. Enjoyed following the build.
Jim
An excellent model. Enjoyed following the build.
Jim
Richard48
SMF Supporter
Stunning Jakko.
Great modelling.
Richard
Great modelling.
Richard
Lovely job Jakko. Certainly looks the part.
Gotta agree with the guys....
Superb build Jakko
Seems more like a "Why not" than a "What if"
Andy
Superb build Jakko
Seems more like a "Why not" than a "What if"
Andy
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Thanks The “why not” part is pretty easy: money plus differing opinions on what an MBT needs to be.
The MBT 70 programme was cancelled because Germany pulled out, after having spent either 310 or 476 million DM (depending on which source you believe) on just the development of the prototypes; the USA had spent either about 530 or 625 million DM on top of that as well (I don’t have US dollar values at hand right now) for a total of between 830 million and 1.1 billion DM in costs from late 1963 to late 1969. This when the whole project, including actual tank production for both nations, had initially been predicted to cost 293 million DM. I’m sure everyone back then understood that these things never work out at the initial estimate, but this was excessive even with that in mind.
To put those values into perspective: 293 million DM in 1963 is 1.27 billion euros today, and 1.1 billion DM in 1969 is 4.09 billion euros.
The second part of the reason was that the Americans and Germans had ideas about tank design that were not that close together, yet had to be unified somehow. For example, the Americans wanted their 152 mm gun-launcher that could fire both conventional rounds and guided anti-tank missiles, while the Germans wanted a standard gun. The Americans wanted an air-cooled engine, the Germans a water-cooled one. The Americans wanted to measure things in inches, the Germans in millimetres. Compromises were found for many of these issues (the engine compartment would accommodate both engines, each country built things using its own preferred measurements but all connectors between actual parts would be standardised, etc.) but on the whole, neither side was very happy with how it all worked out. The American insistence on several features the Germans didn’t want, or at least didn’t see the point of, eventually were the other main reason for them to withdraw.
The Americans then tried to simplify the MBT 70 into the XM803, but that also ended up being very expensive. Eventually the US Army was told to begin again and design an MBT to a strict budget, which resulted in the M1 Abrams. To give an idea of the cost-cutting involved there: the reason the commander’s cupola on the M1 is equipped with the already venerable M2 HB .50-calibre machine gun, is because large numbers of those were at hand and therefore essentially free.
The “why not” part is pretty easy: money plus differing opinions on what an MBT needs to be.The MBT 70 programme was cancelled because Germany pulled out, after having spent either 310 or 476 million DM (depending on which source you believe) on just the development of the prototypes; the USA had spent either about 530 or 625 million DM on top of that as well (I don’t have US dollar values at hand right now) for a total of between 830 million and 1.1 billion DM in costs from late 1963 to late 1969. This when the whole project, including actual tank production for both nations, had initially been predicted to cost 293 million DM. I’m sure everyone back then understood that these things never work out at the initial estimate, but this was excessive even with that in mind.
To put those values into perspective: 293 million DM in 1963 is 1.27 billion euros today, and 1.1 billion DM in 1969 is 4.09 billion euros.
The second part of the reason was that the Americans and Germans had ideas about tank design that were not that close together, yet had to be unified somehow. For example, the Americans wanted their 152 mm gun-launcher that could fire both conventional rounds and guided anti-tank missiles, while the Germans wanted a standard gun. The Americans wanted an air-cooled engine, the Germans a water-cooled one. The Americans wanted to measure things in inches, the Germans in millimetres. Compromises were found for many of these issues (the engine compartment would accommodate both engines, each country built things using its own preferred measurements but all connectors between actual parts would be standardised, etc.) but on the whole, neither side was very happy with how it all worked out. The American insistence on several features the Germans didn’t want, or at least didn’t see the point of, eventually were the other main reason for them to withdraw.
The Americans then tried to simplify the MBT 70 into the XM803, but that also ended up being very expensive. Eventually the US Army was told to begin again and design an MBT to a strict budget, which resulted in the M1 Abrams. To give an idea of the cost-cutting involved there: the reason the commander’s cupola on the M1 is equipped with the already venerable M2 HB .50-calibre machine gun, is because large numbers of those were at hand and therefore essentially free.
