Vallejo Air Primer - A little help please

[Cooperman69]

Hi all,

I've come to the conclusion that I like to prime my kits prior to airbrushing and have until recently used rattle cans from Halfords or the more refined Tamiya Fine primer. The thing I don't like about rattle cans is the uncontrollable nature of their spray, it's usually all or nothing with lots of overspray.

So I decided to give Vallejo Air Primer a go through my airbrush and to be honest I'm very happy with the results. Even though this product is designed for airbrushing straight from the bottle I do find it's very thick and for me it needs a 50/50 mix with Vallejo thinner to be able to spray at about 15-20 psi.

I still need to be quite quick as it dries on the needle within 5-10 seconds if not used and is a headache to keep taking the nozzle off the airbrush to clean the needle (it's a Badger 200 single action).

Now the problem is when it comes to cleaning it seems to take half a dozen cups of strong airbrush cleaner or Vallejo's own cleaner to get anywhere near clean. In fact the few times I've used it I end up stripping the airbrush to clean off the needle, nozzle and cup seperately! Am I missing the obvious or is primer through an airbrush a little trickier to use and clean than paint acrylics?

Atb,

Colin.

 

[BarryW]

I always strip the airbrush after every session. But for colour changes I just spray through two cupfuls, one of diluted window cleaner and then one of Vallejo airbrush cleaner.

When I strip it I use cotton buds and IPA to get it thoroughly clean.

Incidentally, I spray Vallejo Primer as it comes at about 20psi and find it is brilliant. I have never thinned it.

I think it can be a little trickier though.

My a/b is a H&S Evo 2in1 that is very easy to strip. Never used a Badger Colin so I do not know if that would change what I do.

 

[Cooperman69]

Thanks for the reply Barry.

So is it good practice that I clean my airbrush every session then? I thought I was being a bit OCD about it but it does only take a few minutes to be honest. I tend to use a soft cut down brush to clean out the a/b but I'll try your tip of cotton buds next time.

Do you ever suffer from drying on the nozzle without using a thinner?

Now I've tried airbrushing for a little while I was thinking about getting a dual action a/b as it's a pain everytime I want to adjust the paint or unblock a nozzle.

The Badger is pretty easy to strip down, just need to be careful passing the needle in from the back.

 

[BarryW]

Hi Colin.

Yes, with acrylics the nozzle drying is a common problem. When I am doing a lot of spraying with one colour I will not fill the cup completely and do the model in sections, spraying a cup of Vallejo thinner through in between every cupful, sometimes also brushing lightly the needle with a paintbrush dipped in a/b cleaner first. When priming my ZM Skyraider, a big model, I did a quick strip clean in the middle of the priming as well.

It is a pain but the results are worthwhile and my a/b is very quick and easy to strip clean.

I find the Vallejo primer excellent, self-levelling and it cures to a very satisfying hard smooth finish. I also leave 24 hours before painting over it.

As for a dual action. I have never used a single action a/b myself. I thoroughly recommend the H&S Evo but I understand the Iwata's supplied by John are good too, even their fairly basic one.

 

[tecdes]

Hi Colin.

With your single action brush you have little much more control than using the can. The only extra control you have is, depending on the brush, external control on the air pressure from the compressor.

With dual action brushes you have external control over the air pressure of the compressor plus paint volume controlled by the amount the trigger is pulled back.

Also with dual action & gravity feed it enable you to replenish paint direct into the cup, saving paint as you decant as necessary, plus the opportunity to mix directly in the cup using proportional drops from the dropper bottle the Vallejo comes in.

The end of last week I had four sessions priming with an air brush. I use a Harder & Steenbeck. Have to say that these H & S with Iawata are very popular with experienced model makers. Lots of arguments of which is best. From all read they each have their good points & minor not so good. But those who have used both seem to be happy with both which are best quality engineered brushes. So take you pick is it to be BMW or Mercedes.

What ever you buy get one which allows you to change needles nozzle sizes. I would suggest gravity fed (definite).

So to priming. Large area 1/48 helicopter. I first had a .2 size nozzle needle. Sure enough all started well but then started spurting out little droplets & clogged. Noticed that primer was building up on the lower bar of the needle shield. Incidentally spraying Vallejo primer at 25 what ever it is pressure (lower for the other Vallejo paints 20 but 25 also for varnish). Nice thing about Vallejo the small droplets dried out flat it is a very forgiving paint. Tried thinning but this if anything made things worse.

So then decided I would go to a .4 nozzle needle. That worked perfectly without any thinning. Thinning. Always use Vallejo Thinners. It has acrylic resin base as does the paint which gives better adhesion. Also think, my speculation, that it has a small amount of retarder in it. Also lubricates the brush while brushing. If you use water this will make the evaporation time shorter & more likely to shorten & cause problems. Just to add these are my experiences.

I always, after a session, dismantle the brush, needle & nozzle off, brush through the needle tunnel & paint channel using warm/hotish water. Ream in hot water the nozzle blow through & sight along to make sure it is perfectly clear. Takes 4 minutes. Perhaps one minute more than a half clean. The only part needing Vallejo Airbrush cleaner is the cup which a drop on a tissue will clear. Then half a cup of cleaner blasted through the brush to finish & lubricate. Most important. If you look at a shaft of sunlight in your room you will see the air full of bits your nose collects them so will the brush cup. So I put a piece of tissue in the cup to protect from all those small hairs & bits. Also when using your brush blast away residue of water & cleaner which slides down into the needle nozzle area.

Sorry probably tedious but for me it all works from experience.

Extra bit. Before brushing make sure doors are not opened & closed quickly as it disturbs the air, watch your sunlit shaft of light. Also spray into the air at high level a water mist then let settle.

Laurie

 

[AJay]

Colin, I use the same primer as you, and afterwards clean with Vallejo's Airbrush cleaner - I do this by putting a few drops of cleaner in the cup and spraying it through at around 30psi; I then spray some water through.

After that, I mainly strip the airbrush down after every session, to rub the needle down with cleaner, etc. The acrylic paint dries very quickly into a hard plastic material, so will easily clog the ab up. When starting a new session, I spray water through to check it's working, and if not, some airbrush cleaner. It's an annoying business when you want to just get on and paint, I know..........

During the spray session, I keep a cotton bud (with the end soaked in the cleaner), to gently dab the needle clean - otherwise it blocks very quickly! Grrrr

I'm still new to the airbrush, but think I'm getting the hang of it.

 

[Cooperman69]

Thanks for all your input guys, as always top advice.

I think what I really need to do first is get myself into a routine when airbrushing so everything is to hand when needed, and following an a/b session then strip and clean (the airbrush that is ). I've recently been more confident with the stripping and cleaning and can now complete it in a little over 5 mins.

I've been using Vallejo cleaner along with some other a/b solvent cleaner ,which the name escapes me at the moment, and found the solvent much more effective. I usually put a cup of the solvent through the emptied cup followed by a cup of the Vallejo, of which I leave a minute amount in the bottom before putting away.

As for the primer, I've been using it again this evening and even though you need to be a bit quick to avoid drying on the tip it, certainly gives a lovely finish and I'm thinner about 60/40 with Vallejo thinner. It does dry into a plastic material around the edge of the cup but easily removed when cleaning.

I was wondering if life would be easier with needle blockages by using a dual action a/b. Instead of having to clean off the tip and reset the adjuster on the rear of a single action couldn't you give a pull back on the trigger to blast some paint through and clear the needle?

 

[tecdes]

Just a note Colin try just using water when stripping as I detailed you should not need that cleaner except for paint which congeals in the cup.

Certainly be better off with a dual action as you control paint flow which at times is essential.

Yes some times you can clear blockages with a full burst other times as Barry gave a good tip use a paint brush dipped in cleaner. Also given the front needle end a squirt with cleaner some times works.

Think practice & routine are the answer.

Laurie

 

[Cooperman69]

Sorry Laurie I meant to ask about the water but forgot.

So you strip and rinse with warm water, I'll try that next time. Certainly be more cost effective and less smelly and offensive than the solvent and I'll finish with a drop of Vallejo cleaner to lube.

What H&S airbrush do you have by the way?

Atb,

Colin

 

[tecdes]

That is how I do it Colin there are many ways but water is cheap. If you are changing colour in a session I use Vallejo Cleaner as it is all compatible.

My H & S is the Evolution.

John does Iawata in the shop. Have a word with him. Nobody has counted up but I suspect there is a very equal divide among both types.

Laurie

 

[Cooperman69]

Thanks again for all your help.

Colin

 

[phalinmegob]

i have been using a badger 200 for about a year until yesterday when i tried one of those gold ones for a fiver off e-bay recommended by patrick and i am converted to dual action allready. will look at getting an iwata in the near future but this one seems fine for the moment.

 

[Cooperman69]

My H & S is the Evolution.

John does Iawata in the shop. Have a word with him. Nobody has counted up but I suspect there is a very equal divide among both types.

Laurie

Hi Laurie,

Can I just ask you to confirm your airbrush is the H&S Revolution, as I thought the Evolution you quoted was the Iwata model?

Thanks,

Colin.

 

[tecdes]

Hi Laurie,Can I just ask you to confirm your airbrush is the H&S Revolution, as I thought the Evolution you quoted was the Iwata model?

Thanks,

Colin.

Mine is an Harder & Steenbeck Evolution Colin. Do not know any more about Iwata other than reports of them being a high quality brush.

Laurie