Primer Questions

[Easyrider5258]

New returnee to this hobby, (was a regular kit builder 30 years ago) building up my stock of paints, tools etc., have gone with a selection of Vallejo acrylic paints, but getting a little confused over which primer to work with, seems reading posts on here its not straightforward, I will be Airbrushing, (Iwata) lot of recommends for lacquer primers which I will be overpainting with Acrylic, any problems doing this with reactions? should I stick to Acrylic primer? but I read problems with those too, recommendations please, Thanks, Mark.

 

[Steven000]

I use Vallejo acrylic primer because I'm spraying inside the house (doesn't smell bad), for me that works fine, but you can't 'sand' the stuff, it sort of becomes a rubbery-layer. Detail is very good imho.
Cheers

 

[Andy T]

There's a current topic talking about acrylic primers which is worth a read. For me, some seem to work very well, others not so well.

If you decide on lacquer primer instead, you'll have no problem spraying over it with acrylic pant once it is dry.

 

[Easyrider5258]

There's a current topic talking about acrylic primers which is worth a read. For me, some seem to work very well, others not so well.

If you decide on lacquer primer instead, you'll have no problem spraying over it with acrylic pant once it is dry.

I have read several times all the posts on paints and primers on here, with Vallejo primers it seems some may not be letting it fully cure before sanding and finding problems, I read on here it may take several days depending on humidity to cure properly, anybody agree with that?

Going on the principle it is better to use the manufactures primer as paint
Pleased to read no problem overcoating Lacquer primer with acrylic
What about using oils for weathering and over coating with acrylic matte spray?

Thanks

Mark

 

[Andy T]

I've not experimented with water based acrylic primers enough to be certain, but it would definitely make sense that insufficient curing could cause problems. They feel dry first when the solvent (water) evaporates, but cure / crosslink and gain full strength later.

Most oils take a long time to fully dry. It can be speeded up with certain additives, and a hairdryer is your friend, but I've had no problems spraying acrylic (or lacquer) varnish over them afterwards.

 

[Jakko]

My only experience with Vallejo primer from a bottle (as opposed to an aerosol) was that even after letting it dry for about 24 hours, I could scratch it off the model with my fingernail. And this was when it was applied over Mr. Aqueous Color acrylic paint (which is alcohol-based, BTW) — I didn’t try it on bare plastic, but the person whose primer it was¹ told me he could just wipe it off with his finger from plastic wargames figures he sprayed with it.

By contrast, Vallejo primer from an aerosol works very well, IMHO, and is very much more durable. However, it will leach colour from some brands of plastic (at least Academy, and I suspect also Tamiya).

IMHO, though, an important question is whether you need primer at all. You say you will be spraying acrylics, but which kind? If you intend to use water-based ones like Vallejo, MIG, Hakatakatakakatawhatever, and similar, then my experience is that you almost need a coat underneath for no other reason than to get around the risk of the paint beading up on the bare plastic. With alcohol-based acrylics like Tamiya and Mr. Aqueous Color, and also the water-based ones from Revell and Italeri, you can just go straight over the plastic with no worries at all. I suspect the same applies to lacquer-based acrylics like Mr. Color (without the “Aqueous”) and Tamiya’s LP-series of paints, but my limited experience with them has been poor enough that I’m not touching them anymore


¹ He wanted my opinion on it, to see if he was doing something wrong or if the paint was crap. We concluded it was the latter.

 

[Waspie]

I've not experimented with water based acrylic primers enough to be certain, but it would definitely make sense that insufficient curing could cause problems. They feel dry first when the solvent (water) evaporates, but cure / crosslink and gain full strength later.

Most oils take a long time to fully dry. It can be speeded up with certain additives, and a hairdryer is your friend, but I've had no problems spraying acrylic (or lacquer) varnish over them afterwards.

I always give 24 hours after using acrylic primer. Can’t remember where I read the recommendation but it seems to be sound.

 

[Tim Marlow]

My only experience with Vallejo primer from a bottle (as opposed to an aerosol) was that even after letting it dry for about 24 hours, I could scratch it off the model with my fingernail. And this was when it was applied over Mr. Aqueous Color acrylic paint (which is alcohol-based, BTW) — I didn’t try it on bare plastic, but the person whose primer it was¹ told me he could just wipe it off with his finger from plastic wargames figures he sprayed with it.

By contrast, Vallejo primer from an aerosol works very well, IMHO, and is very much more durable. However, it will leach colour from some brands of plastic (at least Academy, and I suspect also Tamiya).

IMHO, though, an important question is whether you need primer at all. You say you will be spraying acrylics, but which kind? If you intend to use water-based ones like Vallejo, MIG, Hakatakatakakatawhatever, and similar, then my experience is that you almost need a coat underneath for no other reason than to get around the risk of the paint beading up on the bare plastic. With alcohol-based acrylics like Tamiya and Mr. Aqueous Color, and also the water-based ones from Revell and Italeri, you can just go straight over the plastic with no worries at all. I suspect the same applies to lacquer-based acrylics like Mr. Color (without the “Aqueous”) and Tamiya’s LP-series of paints, but my limited experience with them has been poor enough that I’m not touching them anymore


¹ He wanted my opinion on it, to see if he was doing something wrong or if the paint was crap. We concluded it was the latter.

Don’t get this. I use Vallejo primer, applied from an airbrush, pretty much exclusively on my little blokes and have never had any come off under normal handling. I do, however, give them a detergent bath and clean water rinse before priming. Water based primers will find it very hard to adhere to finger grease and release agent as water simply doesn’t cut through an oil coated surface like lacquer type primers will. Oil and water are immiscible and just don’t mix.
On the other hand I have had issues with Tamiya spray primers. The standard grey is excellent, out of the aerosol or decanted and airbrushed. Very reliable. The superfine white thought is appalling. I found it was like painting on talcum powder. It came off even under the pressure of a paintbrush. It’s probably the only paint I’ve ever thrown away.

 

[Tim Marlow]

I always give 24 hours after using acrylic primer. Can’t remember where I read the recommendation but it seems to be sound.

For Vallejo it’s written on the bottle

 

[Waspie]

For Vallejo it’s written on the bottle

That’ll be it then.
Can’t look atm, I’m sat waiting for my chariot in the service department!!

 

[Jakko]

Don’t get this. I use Vallejo primer, applied from an airbrush, pretty much exclusively on my little blokes and have never had any come off under normal handling. I do, however, give them a detergent bath and clean water rinse before priming.

It could well be that was our problem, of course, but though I wouldn’t mind washing wargaming figures I don’t particularly want to do that with a much more delicate model.

 

[Easyrider5258]

It could well be that was our problem, of course, but though I wouldn’t mind washing wargaming figures I don’t particularly want to do that with a much more delicate model.

Seen Isopropyl alcohol recommended as pre priming / painting wash

 

[Tim Marlow]

It could well be that was our problem, of course, but though I wouldn’t mind washing wargaming figures I don’t particularly want to do that with a much more delicate model.

I wash virtually all of mine before priming/painting. Just use a large soft brush which I bought for that purpose. White metal kits and figures get a scrub with a toothbrush though, they are sometimes really cruddy.