required colours for kits

[markg]

hi,

wasn't sure which section to post this question:-

how can one find out the required colours for a kit so they can be ordered at the same time? As I'm only just starting out, I haven't build any stock yet, and so I have to wait until kit arrives before I know what colours to order

thanks

 

[dubster72]

Hi Mark, tell us what kit you've bought/thinking of buying & maybe we can help pick the best colours. Sometimes even the one's in the instructions are not the best! Patrick

 

[Fenlander]

I have the same problem Mark. I am having to order online as I have no local model shop. It is a case of building up, as Patrick says, shout up what models and I am sure someone will have an idea of what is suitable. However, you do need to build a stock of basics like black, white matt varnish etc. Also consider glue types. I prefer the thin glue applied with a brush. Most appear to like the Tamiya extra thin, I use Humbrol Liquid Poly much the same thing. Also look at superglue, gel types are good for some applications where gap filling is needed and the normal thin for attaching small parts. PVA glue is also useful for ataching aircraft canopies as it dries clear and will not fog the clear plastic with fumes. PVA ca also be used in weathering and diorama building.

Many, myself included, use Johnsons Klear, a floor varnish (basically a gloss acrylic varnish) that you get from you local supermarket. It gives a good protective coat prior to weathering and decals. A flat matt varnish, I like Vallejo Matt Acrylic, if a gloss is not appropriate for the finish of the model.

 

[markg]

Patrick, from emodels I have ordered 2 kits :- Airfix 1/48 Hawker Hurricane Mk.I. # 04102 (AFX04102) & Revell 1/48 Supermarine Spitfire Mk IXc / XVI # 04554 (RVL04554).

From themodeller, I have orderd one North American P-51D Mustang 8th A.F. Aces (TAM-60773).

My plan is to try different manufacturers and firstly try both 1/72 & 1/48 scales. 1/48 seems a good size for WWII fighters but the bombers etc would be quite large models, whereas 1/72 bombers would be about right. No doubt after a bit of practice I will settle on one scale, but maybe not

Thanks Graham for the info. I have received my first order from emodels today, a Badger airbrush plus some tools, and will be ordering some more "basics" over the next few days, so I appreciate your suggestions. I am enjoying looking for and ordering stuff, but it makes my first model a pretty expensive one

 

[stona]

Graham has given a pretty good low down there. As for specific paints,I[ll give you the standard camouflage colours for the British aircraft, unless you're doing something fancy like a photo recon plane.

Hurricane: Dark Earth/Dark Green over Sky.

Spitfire: Ocean Grey/Dark Green over Medium Sea Grey.

You will need other British colours Interior Green and Trainer Yellow.You'll need a brick red colour for the "Tufnol" seat. More general colours like Aluminium to get you going. You'll soon have a cupboard full of paint!

I'm not so sure exactly which Mustang that is. It's probably a NMF (natural metal finish,i.e. Aluminium) but you will need Zinc Chromate yellow for parts of the wheel well (the main spar at the back) and one of the U.S.interior colours for the cockpit,probably Dull Dark green.Anti glare panels ,infront of the cockpit, were usually in Olive Drab.

Next you'll find yourself buying a brown leather colour for headrests,though not in the Spitfire.

Don't be put off. I find that my stock of basics lasts a very long time,it is only really the camouflage colours that get used up.

Happy painting

Steve

 

[markg]

great stuff stona (Steve) , very helpful thanks. Should I get a mix of enamel and acrylic paints? Or maybe that'll end up being a personal preference thing?

 

[Fenlander]

You can use enamel or acrylics. Some say that enamel has a better coverage and finish but I personally use acrylics. The main thing to remember is that you can use acrylic on top of enamel but if you paint enamel over acrylic, it can react and crack the acrylic undercoat. It is a personal thing but I like the easy cleaning, with water, of brushes etc when using acrylic. Acrylics tend to be faster drying to, very important for impatient old gits like me lol.

As far as I can see from reading as I do not have an airbrush yet, acrylic thinners is used to thin paint for airbrushing. I only brush paint at the moment and find water thinned acrylics brush OK.

 

[markg]

so Graham, is it possible then for someone to exclusively use acrylics or enamel? I haven't a clue yet as to how they are to use or their effect. The ease of acrylic that you mention is a point in it's favour certainly, but do some(all?) models need both types, say enamel for cockpit and stuff, and acrylic for larger areas? Or like you say, enamel as an undercoat and an acrylic topcoat? When I start on the models I'll try to stop pestering with questions so much, but at this stage I'm a real novice.

 

[dubster72]

Just to add my penny's worth Mark, what Graham says is all very true, although I've never had any untoward effects from using acrylic over enamels or vice-versa. What you'll probably find is that acrylics are the best for airbrushing, mainly for their ease of cleaning, even if the quality isn't as good as enamels. For brushing, I only use enamels because I find they go on well & don't leave brushmarks if properly thinned. I think the best way to discover what works best for you is experimenting. Don't be put off by failures, we've all had them! It's all part of the learning process. And don't worry about asking questions, we're all happy to help. Patrick

 

[Fenlander]

I do not use any enamel as yet. At the end of my first stint in modelling, which was a long time ago, acrylics were just making their mark. Tamiya acrylics were the first one I used and I fell in love with them and left my little tins of Humbrol enamels to dry out. I would not say I would never use enamels again, never say never to anything in modelling.

What I do miss though from those days was the range of Humbrol (I think) 'Authentic' They cost more but there was a range of military and railway matched colours in high quality paint. I don't understand why they did not re create the Authentic range in acrylic.

Perhaps I should try enamels as I have just looked at the Humbrol enamel range and it is huge compared to the acrylics. Patrick is right, asking questions is not pestering, it is using the forum to expand everyones knowledge. Trust me, I have seen really relevant questions asked and answered that I would never have even thought of asking.

Now here is one for Patrick. You say that enamels brush well if 'properly thinned' Can I ask what ratio you thin them to?

 

[dubster72]

Ah now that's a good question Graham! To be honest, I can't give you a definitive reply because I do it by 'feel' that is, how the loaded brush feels as I make a few test strokes on scrap. Also because the amounts of paint used are small, measuring it exactly would be difficult.

Overall, I'd say it's about 50/50 maybe 60/40 thinner vs paint in most situations. I find the main benefit with enamels over acrylics is that the paint 'flows' much better from the brush. It's almost like bring the brush to the part & it coats itself rather than actively brushing the paint on. Mind you, I've found that to be the case as well with my limited use of Vallejo paints too so maybe they'd be an acceptable compromise.

Patrick

 

[Fenlander]

Cheers Patrick, I do understand what you mean, I don't measure when thinning either. Interesting that you mention Vallejo acrylics. I have just got a bottle of German Field Grey and German Uniform, which looks quite green. I am hoping that the Uniform is for the jackets etc while the field grey may be suitable for the long coats and some trouser. Not really sure yet as I have not had chance to experiment. As I am getting a backup of figures to do, I need to get experimenting lol.

 

[dubster72]

Actually, Field Grey is a bit of a misnomer really because it's a shade of green rather than grey. Sometimes you see figures looking almost blue where people believe it should be grey & then go too far down that route. I've read a few accounts of German soldiers and none of them were particually impressed by the colour of their battledress, saying it didn't match with anything found in nature! No wonder they used captured Russian smocks & ponchos!

 

[stona]

so Graham, is it possible then for someone to exclusively use acrylics or enamel? I haven't a clue yet as to how they are to use or their effect. The ease of acrylic that you mention is a point in it's favour certainly, but do some(all?) models need both types, say enamel for cockpit and stuff, and acrylic for larger areas? Or like you say, enamel as an undercoat and an acrylic topcoat? When I start on the models I'll try to stop pestering with questions so much, but at this stage I'm a real novice.

Don't worry about the questions, it's what the forum is for and there are plenty here more than happy to help. I'd reinforce what the guys have said. I would recommend spraying acrylic paints,which brand is very much a personal choice. I do mainly WWII Luftwaffe and some allied and use Xtracrylix because they do the best matches by far for these colours and it saves me mixing. I'm basically lazy! Acrylics are also less smelly and clean up with more innocuous reagents.Whilst I'm building a model I do no more than flush my airbrush(s) with Muc-Off (a bike cleaner from Halfords) inbetween sessions. They also dry much quicker which is a nice bonus. I use a mixture of acrylics and enamels for brush painting but this is only really detail painting in cockpits,engines etc and some dry brushing.There is no reason why you can't use exclusively one or the other,I just have a large stock of enamels that I built up over years before I started spraying acrylic.

You certainly don't need an enamel undercoat for acrylic paint though most people do apply a primer. A lot of us use the grey primer from Halfords which is a lot cheaper than specific model paints. We like to save you a bob or two here as well.

When you start your model you'll probably have more questions! Fire away,someone will have an answer.

Steve

 

[markg]

that's a GREAT help.. thanks Steve