Why do people condem acrylic primer

[David Lovell]

Just because some are incapable of setting the air pressure and thinning the paint correctly it seems we should be forced to use the new range of lacquer shake and go paints these are apparently complete no brainers , though in my opinion bloody expensive ,not all of us work from magnificent man caves with spray booths to cope with lacquer fumes and stink ,rattle cans are OK I used them to prime when I started but tremendous amount of overspray half the can misses the target after all its meant for car door /wings touch up then all that decanting gassing off then put it through your airbrush why not buy a tin of primer and use it from the tin must be cheaper.
Whats wrong with acrylic primer there's a good choice out there or is it just people cant use it because well because I still can't fathom that bit just because some dont get on with it they shouldn't keep condemning it almost to the point of my way or no way.
To thoes starting out it must make them want to jack before they've even started there's nothing wrong with acrylic primer you use it the same as all your other bottles/jars of acrylic paint the airbrush procedure is the same correct thinning and pressure


Done using mr hobby aqueous surfacer grey and black ,next up the much hated and unusable one shot primer


I dont think I'm doing anything wrong im quite happy with the results ,if people aren't able to use it fine but don't condem it as inferior to the product you've found that suits your capabilities better its a primer and it primes plastic as good as the next one.
This will no doubt bring down the wrath from the few but as I said why do people condem acrylic primer if YOU can't use it fine move on im glad that there's a alternative product to suit your capabilities but thousands out there are more than happy with acrylic primer and paints.

 

[Dave Ward]

David,
I agree with you - I use acrylic primers exclusively, and I often wonder why other modellers have problems with them! I don't like the smell of thinners, living in a flat. it lingers too long, and it wasn't until water based paints became widely available that I bought an airbrush.
As an aside - Royal Mail won't accept cellulose/lacquer paints/sprays for normal delivery, so you have to pay a premium for courier/special delivery - which doesn't apply to the water based variety!
Dave

 

[stillp]

Are there people who condemn acrylic primers in general then David? I've seen a lot of criticism of Vallejo primers, which I happen to agree with as it doesn't adhere well and won't sand to a feather edge, but Stynylrez seems to be popular. I haven't tried that Ammo One Shot primer, and I won't, because I've had problems with Ammo paints in the past.
Pete

 

[Scratchbuilder]

I do not condemn acrylics. And I find they have their uses, but not for me the primer. I have either had a bad batch or there was a fault with the primer itself. I have sprayed two models with acrylic primer and in both cases the finish was not what I expected. I had to sand down the primer to get a smooth finish and even then I was not happy with the end result.
And so I have reverted back to lacquer/enamel paints and primers, but I do use acrylic for detail painting. But this had a drawback in that I could not spray in the house because of the smell/fumes, so it was build my own spray booth and install it in the shed. That in itself solved the spray problem, but then I had the problem of running an extension lead up to the shed, which is ok during sunny or cold weather but a no no when it is raining even though the cable is 'rubber' covered and the connection points are in the dry, don't fancy sparks emanating from my arris...
But now thanks to YT, I have a solution that actually works and I can spray happily in doors, except for the noise of the extractor fan, but hey! that's what AC/DC are for....

 

[Tim Marlow]

Not sure what you are driving at here Dave?

I’ve used all sorts of primers over the years, including household primer undercoat in my more impecunious days. Always found car primer best for etched brass models because it sticks exceptionally well to sheet metal. It was my go to back in the day when all you could get was Humbrol paint. Cellulose knife stopping was a great filler to use with it as well. Not really used car paint since they went acrylic though as I find the cans lay down too much paint too quickly.

I currently use the Vallejo acrylic for the little blokes. Sticks well, holding up under handling (the little blokes are gaming figures so are made to be handled) goes on flat, and covers ok. No problem spraying it if it’s diluted a bit with airbrush thinner and has a few drops of flow improver added, just like any other acrylic paint. Can be brush painted as well, which is something I sometimes do if I miss a patch when batch spraying. Takes a good twenty four hours to dry properly though, unusual for an acrylic.

Dont use it for things like tanks, aircraft or cars though because I find I can’t sand it to a feather edge if I need to do remedial work once the primer is on. It just tears under sanding, even if carried out wet.

Always wanted to use stynylres but on the rare times I‘ve needed to top up with primer I can’t find it for sale. If it is an acrylic primer that sands when dry then it could become my go-to, but I’ll reserve judgement until I’ve tried it.

 

[Gary MacKenzie]

Never condemned any paints bar Airfix / Humbrol enamels from the 1980s and the horrible paints they have in their starter kits.
Not sure why you think people are ''forcing'' you to change.

Just because some are incapable of setting the air pressure and thinning the paint correctly it seems we should be forced to use the new range of lacquer shake and go paints these are apparently complete no brainers

You complain about people saying that they shouldn't say one is worse than the other, and appear to then do the same yourself.

 

[BarryW]

I am really glad it works for you Dave and, of course, if you cannot have a dedicated modelling space and extractor booth, water based acrylics would be ideal.

I don’t agree that people condemn water based acrylic primers as such. Stynylrez and its ‘white labelled’ cousins like One Shot, work very well. I actually have some, though I don’t use it often (I did use it on my Merlin’s…). Vallejo primer though does have a well deserved bad reputation, I did make it work for years until I found Stynylrez, but it was always problematical with it vulnerability to humidity.

If you can have a dedicated space though, with a decent extractor, I do recommend acrylic lacquers as they are well worth a small extra cost for their faultless and forgiving performance.

 

[JR]

It's all a matter of choice, I like many started with Vallejo primer. Eventually dumping the lot.
Moved ,as I was unhappy with the contant blocking on the ab even though I tried more thinners, extender, newts blood , and blood of bat so used AK 3rd gen.That was brilliant. Then found black , grey and white MrHobby, even better .
Between AK 3rd gen ( until its all used up ) and Mr Hobby

 

[Waspie]

Well for me, as a newbie to this building lark. I started with acrylic primer. Had some issues when first starting to use but after some reading and advice from the chaps on here regards pressures and mix. I've had no issues, even less with the new airbrush!
Never used a can and have no intentions of using unless something radical changes. Goes down to horses for courses again!!

 

[David Lovell]

Got you all talking come on guys there's been quite a lot of i use this now its much better than acrylics id never go back to them well good on ya but some times put in a strong way that we should all comply as I said if it suits your abilities great .

 

[David Lovell]

Well for me, as a newbie to this building lark. I started with acrylic primer. Had some issues when first starting to use but after some reading and advice from the chaps on here regards pressures and mix. I've had no issues, even less with the new airbrush!
Never used a can and have no intentions of using unless something radical changes. Goes down to horses for courses again!!

Yes it takes a certain amount of working it your own way but as you say no issues once confident with the product

 

[Mark1]

Only one ive had problems with is vallejo, have been using tamiya rattle can simply because i can do a complete model in about 4 seconds and about the same drying time lol

 

[Scratchbuilder]

It's all a matter of choice, I like many started with Vallejo primer. Eventually dumping the lot.
Moved ,as I was unhappy with the contant blocking on the ab even though I tried more thinners, extender, newts blood , and blood of bat so used AK 3rd gen.That was brilliant. Then found black , grey and white MrHobby, even better .
Between AK 3rd gen ( until its all used up ) and Mr Hobby

You forgot the milk from a witches t..... I tried it once and turned into a newt....

 

[Scratchbuilder]

Got you all talking come on guys there's been quite a lot of i use this now its much better than acrylics id never go back to them well good on ya but some times put in a strong way that we should all comply as I said if it suits your abilities great .

I will agree with your comment, if you have not tried it then how can you be critical or positive, as you say horses for courses. And if we were all using the same paint aka back in the dark days of Humbrol, then the ugly head of 'is that colour accurate would start again...'

 

[Ian M]

My only beef with SOME acrylic primers are they are to soft and or i got masking peel. So I avoid that one and use another.

 

[andy55]

Ah what the hell, I'll stick my two pennerth worth in. As a newbie I only tried one acrylic primer, the Army Paint. Supposed to to AB ready, wouldn't go through the AB no matter what pressure or how it was further thinned. Not the AB as I then used it for normal acrylics.
Just this am used a Halfords Plastic primer rattle can with brilliant results. HOWEVER don't want to have to go in garage every time I want to spray primer, so may have to take another look at the acrylics that others recommend.
Also there's a very good thread on here re using a bucket and water trap.

 

[Waspie]

Ah what the hell, I'll stick my two pennerth worth in. As a newbie I only tried one acrylic primer, the Army Paint. Supposed to to AB ready, wouldn't go through the AB no matter what pressure or how it was further thinned. Not the AB as I then used it for normal acrylics.
Just this am used a Halfords Plastic primer rattle can with brilliant results. HOWEVER don't want to have to go in garage every time I want to spray primer, so may have to take another look at the acrylics that others recommend.
Also there's a very good thread on here re using a bucket and water trap.

I was going to throw a 200ml bottle of acrylic primer after it being dreadful to AB with. However, someone on here mentioned sticking with it and experimenting with thinning and pressures which I did. In the end I discovered a method of thinning that worked. In a nutshell, I mix either water or a thinning agent with the primer until it drips readily off the brush I use to stir/mix the two elements. It's not written in concrete but as a rule of thumb it works for me. Even better now I have a better AB to work with. Only criticism would be after using it with the AB it does need a good clean rather than just a quick clean.
The bucket and water trap is attractive I must admit. I'm thinking of making my own booth from cardboard. Watched a YT vid on it. I have the extractor so May have a dabble when the weather gets better!!

 

[andy55]

Hi Doug, with the primer probably just me, but even brushing from the bottle wasn't much good (my opinion). Seen a few cardboard booths, but liked the idea of using a plastic box. Decided to go with armour rather than boats/ships (always was first love) so wouldn't need to be very big box. Will be using the water trap as well.

 

[David Lovell]

I was going to throw a 200ml bottle of acrylic primer after it being dreadful to AB with. However, someone on here mentioned sticking with it and experimenting with thinning and pressures which I did. In the end I discovered a method of thinning that worked. In a nutshell, I mix either water or a thinning agent with the primer until it drips readily off the brush I use to stir/mix the two elements. It's not written in concrete but as a rule of thumb it works for me. Even better now I have a better AB to work with. Only criticism would be after using it with the AB it does need a good clean rather than just a quick clean.
The bucket and water trap is attractive I must admit. I'm thinking of making my own booth from cardboard. Watched a YT vid on it. I have the extractor so May have a dabble when the weather gets better!!

Doug try flushing through with a decent cleaner , mr hobby tool cleaner is my favourite it will remove the brown stuff off the blanket with no problem's, a couple of flushes through with it then some thinner or water job done our own John Race used it on what he thought was a well cleaned airbrush and was shocked at what came out ,its very strong they recomend not to use it on cheaper airbrushes for fear of melting the seals/washers thingy's.
But yep you've guessed it ,I still put it through my cheepies as well with so far no adverse affects but I've never stripped a airbrush down only ever flushed through with said cleaner I do occasionally pull the needle out the back and give it a good wipe but thats all. Dave
This isn't meant to be telling persons how to clean a airbrush just how I go about it ,that way I dont break anything ie over tighten and snap nozzles its just left how the manufacturer put it together. Its clean so why take it apart.

 

[Scratchbuilder]

Ah what the hell, I'll stick my two pennerth worth in. As a newbie I only tried one acrylic primer, the Army Paint. Supposed to to AB ready, wouldn't go through the AB no matter what pressure or how it was further thinned. Not the AB as I then used it for normal acrylics.
Just this am used a Halfords Plastic primer rattle can with brilliant results. HOWEVER don't want to have to go in garage every time I want to spray primer, so may have to take another look at the acrylics that others recommend.
Also there's a very good thread on here re using a bucket and water trap.

Order from Azon, Hycote is the same brand just a different label and will save on your fuel.