COMPLETED - Andrew's 1/72 Airfix Spitfire and 109 'Dogfight Doubles' (BoB GB)

[adt70hk]

Hi all

So this has crossed the finish line and in doing so passed a number of milestones for me:

• Only the 2nd and 3rd planes I’ve completed in well over 35 years.
• First planes done using an AB.
• My first builds reflecting specific real-life items rather than generic builds for our wargaming.
• The first recreation of an actual real-life situation.
• The first time I’ve added aerial “wire”. I used monofilament fishing line (4lb breaking strain to be precise). It does look a bit too thick though, so I’ll use something thinner next time.
• And the first two kits I’ve completed in I don’t know how long but that’s another story…..

All in all I’m happy with what follows given where I started from experience wise, although if I could match the overall paint job of the 109 with the quality of the canopy of the Spitfire I really would think I couldn’t have done any better (although that would be an odd looking plane!).

Most importantly of all Junior is really pleased with it. As it will sit in his bedroom his opinion is the most important one.

You will notice that that Airfix badge stands slightly proud. It’s deliberately not pushed home as Junior thought it would add, and I quote, a “3D effect to the base”.

Below you will also find a summary on this particular engagement. Please feel free to comment on any inaccuracies in my research or indeed if you fill any gaps. I’m slightly ashamed to say that my knowledge of the wars more famous combatants is sorely lacking…….

ACW as usual.

Andrew

PS the build blog can be found here (LINK)

PPS Thanks to Ron and Stona for their input on the background to this engagement.

PPS I hope you will forgive me but the engagement this depicts is a few weeks outside the official time period but it’s the only kits I had in the stash.

--------------------------------------------------------

The planes:

Spitfire Mk1a – serial no. X4586
29/09/1940 – first flight
30/09/1940 – delivered to No. 39 Maintenance Unit @ RAF Colerne
08/10/1940 – delivered to 609 Squadron. Squadron and plane ID ‘PR-O'
28/11/1940 – shot down by a Bf109 SW of Isle of Wight 28/11/1940

Messerschmitt Bf 109-E4
Werknummer 5344
28/11/1940 - shot down by a Spitfire SW of Isle of Wight 28/11/1940 Sorry but I couldn't find any other information on this aircraft.
Unfortunately, I was unable to find any background info on this plane as I had with the Spitfire.


The pilots:

Flight Lieutenant John Charles Dundas
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Dundas_(RAF_officer)
https://www.chch.ox.ac.uk/fallen-alumni/flight-lieutenant-john-charles-dundas

Major Helmut Wick, Geschwader Kommodore, Jagdeschwader 2 ‘Richthofen’
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Wick
https://military.wikia.org/wiki/Helmut_Wick


The engagement on 28/11/1940

The Airfix instructions have the following to say on the encounter:

"Aces became abundant on both sides [in the Battle of Britain] and two who met in the skies over the English Channel in November 1940 are represented in this set. Helmut Wick was the Luftwaffe’s top scorer amassing a total of 56 kills* by the time of his death in November 1940. His victor was Flight Lieutenant John Charles Dundas** , 12 kill ace with the RAF, flying a Sptitfire Mk1a with 609 Squadron, but he too was not to survive the engagement, with Dundas being downed moments later by Wicks’ wingman*** ."

*From what I’ve read Wick and other German ‘Experten’ were not above inflating their number of kills, albeit they were still impressive figures.

**All of the reports I have come across state that Wick may possibly have been shot down by Pilot Officer Eric Marrs instead, albeit they don’t say why.

***Dundas was not shot down by Wicks wingman, Oberleutnant Erich Leie, but by another member of the JG2 Stabsschwarm, Oberleutnant Rudolf Pflanz. According to Wikipedia (all caveats apply!) Leie got separated from Wick in the early stages of the engagement.

What is not in dispute though is that neither pilots’ bodies were recovered. RIP.

Enjoy......(I hope).....

 

[Jim R]

Hi Andrew
Well I reckon that is one to be proud of. A very nice couple of models especially given what you said at the start of your post.
Jim

 

[papa 695]

Great work Andrew.

 

[Deleted member 4539]

And a great finish it is Andrew .

 

[stona]

That's great! A proper dogfight double.

 

[stona]

"All of the reports I have come across state that Wick may possibly have been shot down by Pilot Officer Eric Marrs instead, albeit they don’t say why."

It's just because No 152 Squadron, and Marrs, were in the right area at the right time. All we can do is attempt to reconcile the various reports made by the pilots at the time with the losses. It's notoriously difficult, and not helped by the fact that some of the pilots were killed and never made a report. We will probably never know for sure who shot down Wick. It gives people things to write and argue about! It is very unlikely that any more evidence will turn up now, so it's just how we interpret that which we have.

Here's a bit of trivia. The RAF code letters were not just randomly chosen for size or colour but selected experimentally. Grey was the most visible colour. The colour we know as Sea Grey Medium (or Medium Sea Grey) was, in fact, standardised in 1937 specifically for these markings, not as a camouflage colour, though it was later used as one. The specified 48 inch high letters with six inch strokes were tested for visibility at 500 yards. 18 inch high letters with 2.5 inch strokes were tested at 200 yards. We know that the 48" letters didn't fit on Spitfire fuselages and were usually applied at something like 30", but they should have been readable at 300 yards. They were not; they are almost never quoted in combat reports, implying they were difficult to read in the confusion of air fighting, and when they are quoted they are almost invariably wrong! It was fairly easy for a pilot to identify a Spitfire as the aircraft seen attacking an enemy aircraft, but not a specific Spitfire.

As you say, Wick, Dundas and several others were all shot down in this action and neither Wick nor Dundas were ever found.

 

[adt70hk]

Hi Andrew
Well I reckon that is one to be proud of. A very nice couple of models especially given what you said at the start of your post.
Jim

Jim

Thanks very much. I already have my next victim planned and even started.

ATB

Andrew

 

[adt70hk]

Great work Andrew.

Thank you very much Ian. Much appreciated

All the best

Andrew

 

[adt70hk]

And a great finish it is Andrew .

Thank you Ralph. Whilst far from perfect are not too shabby, at least from a distance!

Andrew

 

[adt70hk]

"All of the reports I have come across state that Wick may possibly have been shot down by Pilot Officer Eric Marrs instead, albeit they don’t say why."

It's just because No 152 Squadron, and Marrs, were in the right area at the right time. All we can do is attempt to reconcile the various reports made by the pilots at the time with the losses. It's notoriously difficult, and not helped by the fact that some of the pilots were killed and never made a report. We will probably never know for sure who shot down Wick. It gives people things to write and argue about! It is very unlikely that any more evidence will turn up now, so it's just how we interpret that which we have.

Here's a bit of trivia. The RAF code letters were not just randomly chosen for size or colour but selected experimentally. Grey was the most visible colour. The colour we know as Sea Grey Medium (or Medium Sea Grey) was, in fact, standardised in 1937 specifically for these markings, not as a camouflage colour, though it was later used as one. The specified 48 inch high letters with six inch strokes were tested for visibility at 500 yards. 18 inch high letters with 2.5 inch strokes were tested at 200 yards. We know that the 48" letters didn't fit on Spitfire fuselages and were usually applied at something like 30", but they should have been readable at 300 yards. They were not; they are almost never quoted in combat reports, implying they were difficult to read in the confusion of air fighting, and when they are quoted they are almost invariably wrong! It was fairly easy for a pilot to identify a Spitfire as the aircraft seen attacking an enemy aircraft, but not a specific Spitfire.

As you say, Wick, Dundas and several others were all shot down in this action and neither Wick nor Dundas were ever found.

Steve

Thank you for the feedback and of course not forgetting all the advice as well!

Thanks for the info on the the squadron and plane IDs. I vaguely remember reading something recently about the topic but as always not level of detail that you have explained.

Thank you again very much.

Andrew

 

[Deleted member 6559]

Superb Andrew, a really nice finish and lots of firsts crossed off as well. Great stuff.

 

[Deleted member 7181]

They look cracking Andrew, nice one!

 

[adt70hk]

Andy

Thank you very much. Coming from you I'll take that as a compliment.

How's your distopian train coming on by the way?

ATB

Andrew

 

[Neil Merryweather]

great result, Andrew. Is the start of a beautiful new relationship...?

 

[yak face]

Super job andrew , they look brilliant , only the 2nd aircraft in 35 years ! Cant wait to see the next one ( no , seriously ,I cant wait 35 years for the next one , Ill be 90 and have forgotten !)

 

[adt70hk]

Superb Andrew, a really nice finish and lots of firsts crossed off as well. Great stuff.

Peter

Thanks for the support and a fair few firsts indeed.

Now I just have to make a decent job of a single aircraft, rather than two decent jobs of two parts on different aircraft!

thanks again.

Andrew

 

[adt70hk]

great result, Andrew. Is the start of a beautiful new relationship...?

Neil, thank you very much.

It's more like rekindling an old love affair!

Like most people I started by doing plane kits with my father. Then I migrated onto armour when I got into wargaming. I got back into the hobby through my son and doing armour for our little wargames and now I've come back to planes!

Thanks again for the support.

ATB

Andrew

 

[Deleted member 7181]

How's your distopian train coming on by the way?

I haven't touched it in a while Andrew, I'm waiting for inspiration. Like much of my stuff it may always be 95% finished

 

[adt70hk]

Super job andrew , they look brilliant , only the 2nd aircraft in 35 years ! Cant wait to see the next one ( no , seriously ,I cant wait 35 years for the next one , Ill be 90 and have forgotten !)

Thanks Tony, much appreciated.

To be honest if I have to wait 35 years for the next one I'll only be about 5 years behind you

I actually have 7 aircraft in the stash now, with one more ordered from John yesterday.

I think I might have a bit of a problem though as 4 of them are Bf 110s of various marks. Oh and then there's also a mosquito. So that makes 5 twin-engined birds in total.

For some reason I've always had a thing for most of the dedicated big twin engined fighters of World war II, albeit not so much those that started out life as bombers.

Thanks again.

Andrew

 

[adt70hk]

I haven't touched it in a while Andrew, I'm waiting for inspiration. Like much of my stuff it may always be 95% finished

I know what you mean. I think I've got about 15 wargaming kits waiting for a wash.....